HeForShe: Ian Ashman | COO, Scrumpies of Mayfair

Ian AshmanIan Ashman is COO of luxury lingerie brand, Scrumpies of Mayfair.

He was previously senior partner at the international law firm, Walkers Global – alongside his wife, Vicki Ashman.

Together they decided to take early retirement and escape the City, but quickly realised they missed business life.

After trying property development and rare diamond dealing, they set up their own luxury knicker brand, Scrumpies of Mayfair, and are now on track to turn over £3 million in 3 years.

Why do you support the HeForShe campaign? For example – do you have a daughter or have witnessed the benefits that diversity can bring to a workplace?

I see equality between men and women as the natural human state in all areas of life and therefore any efforts to achieve that are to be applauded. There is no better way for those efforts to be led by men and boys and particularly the latter as we seek to move on from the attitudes that prevailed in the past and still do prevail in certain areas of life. From an economic perspective, such equality will maximise economic benefit to society and of course families and individuals within societies. I have no doubt that happiness and health benefits follow on from that too. In a work environment, I have always adopted the policy of working with people who are excellent at what they do and allocated tasks so that the skills available to the organisation are applied in the best way possible. The gender of a particular colleague would not be relevant, just the competence in the context of the particular task.

We have five girls and one boy and hope that we have a gender neutral household. Everyone is encouraged to follow their dreams, work hard and try their best. Gender is not something that would even enter the equation and I believe that our son would find it really odd if a female friend felt constrained by her gender. So I see gender equality as an important goal of society, but clearly I have a strong personal interest and would like to think that once our daughters leave the environment of the home, they would not be confronted with barriers hindering their ability to fulfil their potential in whatever arena they choose.

Why do you think it’s important for men to support gender equality in the workplace?

Well firstly, on the basis that gender equality provides the best opportunities to all in terms of finding the most appropriate employment, all individuals, businesses and society benefit from it.   Most importantly however, if we acknowledge that more inequality is faced by women than men in the workplace, there is great power in men standing up and acknowledging that the inequality is harmful and not in their own interests. It is a part of human nature to stick together and a rallying cry and leadership on the part of men in the name of gender equality takes advantage of that inherent characteristic. We have to acknowledge that sometimes it is difficult to persuade a group of the greater good where they might perceive it to be detrimental to them personally. Leadership from men on this issue is powerful and should lead towards quicker attainment of the goal of gender equality. We might surmise that this should not be necessary as gender equality is in the long term interests of all, but the fact is that it can help significantly as not all men share this point of view.

How welcome are men in the gender equality conversation currently?

This question goes to the heart of the issue and of course is the whole rationale behind the existences of HeForShe. The fact is that the majority of men do not see gender equality as their issue. In the main, I do not believe they object to it in principle but they see it as an issue for others, mainly women. I do not see the issue being that men are not welcome in the conversation but more that it passes them by and they are not engaged in it. The challenge, which can be met, is to engage men in the discussion. Once in the discussion, I believe the majority will understand and see the benefits of gender equality. This challenge can be met by organisations spelling out the benefits of gender equality, men in leadership positions issuing the rallying cry and of course by bringing up the younger generation of males to understand gender equality as a given.  Gender equality should not be seen as a threat by men but as a means through which they can make a real difference to society ultimately benefiting all, including their own daughters and granddaughters.

Do you think groups/networks that include the words “women in…” or “females in…” make men feel like gender equality isn’t really their problem or something they need to help with?

This is a difficult question.  As I have mentioned, it is human nature for individuals with shared values or issues to stick together as groups. There can be no doubt that these types of groups have been responsible for many important advancements and the suffragette inspired anniversary this year is timely evidence of that. However, I would prefer to avoid adversarial or exclusionary turns of phrase in the names of groups wherever possible as I see gender equality as a goal of society as a whole and something that men and women should aspire to together. It is very important that men are engaged in this discussion as it will bring about the quicker achievement of the goals of HeForShe. So I would welcome groups or networks perhaps defined by their goals rather than the gender of their members but I do understand why those in similar situations band together.

What can businesses do to encourage more men to feel welcome enough to get involved in the gender debate?

I would be in favour of businesses opening up the gender discussion rather than it being something that is not generally discussed and espousing the benefits of equal opportunities for all. This would be in the interests of maximising the potential of all men and women working in the business and therefore the interests of the business itself. To me, it is self-evident that this would be a good thing. In terms of delivering the message and implanting it in the culture of a particular business, the answer must be training, training and more training. A typical strategy day also offers an opportunity to open up the discussion. A lot of businesses have employee groups tasked with putting together policies and value documents that they want to reflect the values of the business that they work for. A group like this for gender equality or with gender equality within its remit should have both male and female members. The membership should rotate so that as many employees are part of the discussion, feel involved and take ownership of the principle of gender equality.   These policies and values should make everyone feel that they are working in a positive environment for a business that represents and shares their own values. This is positive for employers as it may generate loyalty, respect for co-workers within a business, and it may lead to increased happiness and health of employees and, of course, hopefully productive work hours and profit.

Do you currently mentor any women or have you in the past?

Scrumpies of Mafair has just launched and we outsource a lot of our requirements and work with many women in that context. I would like to think that they benefit somewhat from their interactions with us and the experience that we bring to the table. As an equity partner of a large international law firm in the past, I mentored female colleagues as they progressed through the ranks of the law firm. They were clever, hard-working and the goal was always to deliver a consistently high quality work product and of course to bring more work in and develop the business of the firm.

Have you noticed any difference in mentoring women – for example, are women less likely to put themselves forward for jobs that are out of their comfort zones or are women less likely to identify senior roles that they would be suited for?

I have found women to be somewhat easier to mentor insofar as I have found them to be often less egotistical than their male counterparts. Some male employees have certainly been very forward in attempting to advance their careers but I would not say that this is exclusively the preserve of men. As one might expect, much comes down to the personality of the individual. What I would say however is that any organisation should always be very clear about what is expected from individuals, male or female, in order to progress.   A clear and well thought out performance management system should take away the need for or any perceived benefits of self-promotion. The organisation should be identifying individuals with the ability to rise to senior roles all the time. Why would it not do this? So an organisation au fait with the skills of its workforce should avoid the issue of women not putting themselves forward for roles. My controversial comment is that I do worry a little about some of the perhaps unintended consequences of #MeToo. Abuse of position in any way, shape or form is clearly unacceptable. It is important however that senior employees do mentor more junior including junior female employees. I hope that those male employees are not discouraged from so doing for worry of crossing any lines on the basis that it is better to avoid the risk to their own careers.

Scrumpies of Mayfair are priced from £35, available at www.scrumpiesofmayfair.com

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